Hi,
I lost my wonderful Dobie, Gryphon, to cancer (at 6!) a few years ago, and I am waiting until my kids get older before I get another one, but I have a question for anyone with a lot of experience with protection trained dobes.
Gryph was obedience trained and well-socialized, but not protection trained. Twice, he did a textbook "hold and bark"-- once when a farmhand tried to move our car so he could mow under it (we were in the farmhouse and heard the ruckus), and once when we were visiting mom and one of her friends walked in without knocking. Both times he held the man against the car/door without making contact, and waited for us to show up. A third time, one of my mom's elderly lady friends also walked in without knocking, and she patted him on the head as he barked ferociously, and she walked past (she wasn't a dog person, and my mom had bragged about what a nice "granddog" she had, so she figured he was just "being noisy"!!). Rather than escalate, Gryph just sat down and gave up!
All three times, Gryph made the correct decision, and more force would have resulted in a tragedy.

So, my question is, do you think a protection trained dog, who is used to crossing the line and biting, would have made these same decisions? How does the training affect the dog's decision-making process when the handler is not right there? If someone who lives with a protection trained dobe under family circumstances (where neighborhood kids are always visiting, mom has crazy friends, etc) could answer, I would be very grateful.

Scheutzhund seems like an interesting sport to get into, but Gryph was so protective, I am hesitating at the thought of intensifying/focusing those drives in our future dobe. I welcome any thoughts/experiences.

Thanks,
Elizabeth

It really depends on the quality and direction of the training. Some dogs are taught to bite only on command, some are taught to make decisions. Each trainer has their own unique style as well. In my opinion it is safer to teach a dog protection, as they then have commands associated with biting behavior instead of relying on insinct alone.

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Steve
Dobes are like potato chips, you really can't have just one...

Elizabeth: You described three scenarios, the third being different in that the lady was clearly not a threat but also that she walked confidently past. I would assert, based on my limited experience and education, that 98% of dogs (even some protection trained dogs for that matter) would back down and allow a confident intruder pass. Further, should the bad guy shout or even clap his hands loudly, most dogs would shrink and many would cry, "I-eee I-eee" and run under a table, tail tucked, their brave facade shattered.

I don't think (remember my limited experience/education) the average dog is BORN with self-assured courage. They put on a good show and to the extent that it works for them, at best they frighten some surprise guests, at worst some may even develop into classic schoolyard bullies puffing themselves up by trying it out on everyone. But without an undergirding of confidence and security the dog will always be unpredictable. They may fear-bite your brother-in-law and they may tuck tail and run when the REAL pressure is on.

Formal training gives the dog a picture of what's expected of it. It will build the dog's confidence but more importantly, their predictability.

And that is absolutely true about the time commitment required for a worthwhile training regimen.. though quite fun and rewarding!

Have fun with your new dog(s) when the time is right!